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As a record label owner and creative entrepreneur, Westside Gunn feels it’s his responsibility to diversify the culture before saying goodbye to the game.
Interview: Joey Echevarria
Westside Gunn is a rare breed in the current hip-hop climate. Beyond his imitation-worthy riffs and eccentric personality, the man was a visionary with cross-cultural influence. As co-founder of Griselda Records, along with Benny The Butcher and Conway the Machine, Gunn established Buffalo, New York, a city mostly known for football and chicken wings, into a breeding ground for some of the most respected rap lyricists of the past decade. He’s also successfully worked to bridge the gap between hip-hop and other art forms that are often considered taboo, and he’s not shy about it.
As a kid growing up on New York’s Nickel City East Side, fashion was Westside Gunn’s creative outlet. While he admits he never strived to “be the best rapper,” his skill and creativity in doing so earned him a lot of respect. Gunn has worked with many rappers from all corners of the game, from late legends like DMX and MF Doom to current superstars like Travis Scott and Tyler, the Creator. He’s handled major distribution deals with the likes of Jay-Z and Eminem, while laying the groundwork for the budding careers of Stove God Cooks and Armani Caesar.
A casual listen to Gunn’s extensive catalog could serve as an audio lesson in taking on the world’s most powerful drug cartels, but the 43-year-old Griselda frontman is equally capable of educating school hip-hop minds on the latest fashion trends at Paris Fashion Week and the elusive inner workings of the world of professional wrestling.
In a year that includes his critically acclaimed studio album 12, countless collaborations with high-profile fashion brands like Corteiz and Saucony, and a hard-hitting mixtape series designed to promote his hot new wrestling company, Fourth Rope, Westside Gunn is looking only to add to his undeniable legacy in 2026. Yet, through it all, he firmly believes that when the time comes to hang up the mic, the MC just wants to exit gracefully.
As he prepared for his first international tour of the year, Westside Gunn took to Zoom last November to discuss his music, his passion for a new career in pro wrestling, his carefully crafted exit strategy from the rap game, and more.
XXL: What mentality are you taking into 2026?
My mental state has been different lately. It sounds like I’m super hungry and I have a lot of space. I guess I’m just more mature. I see life differently. I have been focused on my family, my health, and my legacy. Now, I’m just pushing the art as far as I can while I have the energy.
Looking back on last year, your album 12 received universal acclaim. Is this your highlight of 2025?
It’s crazy because I was supposed to drop Awesome God 3 last year, but my brother Infinite got killed, Big Dump. It’s like I don’t really want to do anything anymore, but then something pops into my head. I just want to make classics. I think “12” is a modern classic. It’s stunning from top to bottom.
After that, most of the year was focused on the series Heels Have Eyes. What is the concept behind these projects? How do they fit together?
High Heels is just a mixtape series to me. I just get in there, pour in and have fun. This is not an expectation. I have my Fourth Rope Company, which is a black-owned independent wrestling company, and it’s going crazy. Our show is called “Heels Have Eyes.” That’s just one of the things I want to do with Griselda Records and Fourth Rope co-branding, to expose a lot of people who aren’t familiar with Fourth Rope. I thought, let me start a new series.
What can fans most expect to see from you next year?
It has been a blessed year. I can only pray to God that I wake up and experience it. My fashion is going to be crazy in ’26 and the fourth rope is going to be crazy in ’26. I’m excited about some things. I’m so happy that Awesome God 3 is finally coming out in March. I had two projects in mind that I knew I wanted to do, one was Awesome God 3 and the other was Michelle Records, Me and Stove God Cooks.
I’m about to go on my first international tour. Paris Fashion Week was the first show in Paris and then I started from there. I’ve been doing this for 13 years and I’ve never been on a tour. So, I knew the energy was going to be crazy. This may be the only time you see me. I don’t think I’ll be in a rush to come back. I’m not saying that because I don’t want to see them. I say that because I’m also the CEO of Fourth Rope.
How was The Fourth Rope born? Why are you so passionate about professional wrestling?
I came up with the name because I was the only one sitting in the front row. I said, “There are three ropes in the ring. I’m the fourth rope. It’s like I’m a part of it. It’s an escape for me. It’s therapy for me. It keeps the child in me alive, and everyone needs that.”
I spent six figures a year just sitting in the front row, but I was learning. I’m analyzing. I go backstage and meet the wrestlers, and I start building real relationships. I was going to invest in House of Glory wrestling in Queens, New York, but Master P and I stopped everything due to COVID-19 and everything was put on hold. I always had a vision, and one day, I just said, “You know what? Let’s do it.” My partner was Smoke DZA.
Are you involved in the creative side of the company? Did you write the storyline of “The Fourth Rope”?
Yeah, me and Smokey DZA. When I decided to move up, I brought my brother in because he also lived here and he had a sharp pen. From that point on, we just kept hitting home runs at every show. I know me and him [DZA] Together; we really do get the best promotions in the game.
Even if you don’t know the wrestlers, you might just be here because you know Griselda, you know Smoke DZA, but when you leave, you’re definitely a Fourth Rope fan, 100 percent. We make sure there’s something for you in every game. We don’t have fillers. I treat the fourth rope like Griselda. It’s just about giving the fans and supporters what they want. We live in an evil world. So, if I can bring you art, if I can bring you something to make you smile and enjoy life, that’s what I’m here for.
What’s the future for Griselda Records?
We have an artist, brother Tom Sos, that’s another thing I’m looking forward to in 2026 and pushing him because he’s super awesome, super talented. I will finish Awesome God 3 and finish the series. Then, it’s just Michelle Records and Stove God, and then I can go into the studio and cook with Jay Worthy, or do Liz 3 with Armani Caesar.
I want to show my art as much as possible because I know if I do these two things [projects] This year, and then after that, I’ll probably come back with Conway [the Machine] and benny [the Butcher]. Then I felt like there was nothing else for me to do. There is nothing to prove, nothing to prove that we will never get back together. Just shut them up completely.
Why do you think people think you, Conway and Benny no longer get along and there’s a feud between the three of you?
Because they can’t see us together. You know how that is. We are all grown men. We are all living. Conway got the drum roll. He is always traveling. He’s working on his album. He is making his bag. He does what he does. He’s working on his album. He lived his life. Benny, same thing. He got BSF [Black Soprano Family]. He has a crew. He’s going about his business. Westside Gunn, I’m running. I always take a step back and focus more on curation. I have to do it.
Do you feel like A&R is a lost art in the current state of the game?
Yes. No one controls this shit anymore. This is one of the main issues. A lot of situations now are just blinds within blinds. It was evil, but at least I did my duty.
You mentioned “there’s nothing else to do” after the next few projects. Is this really the case?
Honestly, I feel like Awesome God 3 will be my last album. After that, let me focus on the art. Let me focus on fashion. Let me focus on making others better. With all due respect, I don’t want to be that 50-year-old rapper. I don’t know how much longer I’m going to do this because I go into the game with a mission. My vision is coming to fruition, so that’s a blessing.
It’s been a great year for the veteran leader. I loved that because Griselda was already old when she came in and I felt like I was part of the cool resurgence of the old mind. Now, everyone we respect is down again, which is a good thing for hip-hop. We are running now. Everyone is having fun, collecting checks and taking care of their kids, but let’s be honest. I know this is a youth sport. It’s just a different game. We must respect it.
You have developed a brand for yourself that is widely respected in many art forms, especially hip-hop. However, sometimes it doesn’t seem like enough. Do you have a grudge, or is it a natural competitive spirit based on legacy and influence?
All this. all of the above. I do feel like I have the best resume ever written on paper, but I do feel slighted. I know how many people I impacted. I know how many people have stolen from me. I know how many people I’ve given a helping hand to, but I’ve never gotten anything back.
Some of the greatest names in the game you can think of have used me. I’m too real to say, “Y’all know this whole album came out was my idea. You all know this and that on his album because I made it happen. You never know. You never know. You still don’t know.” When there’s a lot of opportunity, they have to say, “Yo, shout out to Westside Gunn.” They don’t do that.
So, overall, do you feel like you were right in what you accomplished?
I’ve been blessed to be able to say everything I’ve ever wanted to do, and I’ve done it. When I entered this game, I never thought I would play it for this long. But once the following started growing, I would see three-year-olds saying, “Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.” The kids would bring their 65-year-old grandmothers out with them as the merchandise line circled the block twice. This helps me.
What is the next art form you want to conquer?
Movie. I won’t say I haven’t been exposed to it since I premiered the film Adolf starring Roman Streitz at Art Basel. We clashed on Tubi, but I think my foray into film was about putting my ideas on paper; writing and starring. This is one of the reasons why I look better and be healthier. So, all my sex scenes, I have to look great. You know when I was going to write this movie, I was going to have about four sex scenes in the first 30 minutes.
Overall, what do you hope hip-hop culture says about Westside Gunn?
He changed the game. This is not another West End Gunn. I want to be like my Michael Jordan. Let me sit in the box, let me watch my team, let me do what I have to do. I still have different brands. I’m still a legend. I’m still respected.
